I watched it this weekend! A beautiful movie that more American Christians need to see. People are not their governments, look at ours. I have a question for you David. If the American church was one of the 7 churches of Revelation, which one would it be? I had it down to 4 of them but couldn't decide which one fit.
Laodicea: the lukewarm church from materialism and pleasure seeking.
Sardis: seeming alive but really dead with an attractive religious veneer.
Thyatira: infiltrated with paganism.
Pergamon: the church that trusted their own power.
I wish I could say we were Philadelphia or even a Smyrna, but sadly we are not at this point in time. Iranian Christians and others around the world that are under persecution have so much to teach us about really following Christ, but unfortunately many here only see them as our enemy. To me, one of the things this movie was putting out was that there must be a true Christian world church that is united against evil. The NWO has plans for a false one world religion that only seeks to destroy true faith, and bring us all into slavery under Satan. This true Christian church is our only hope to attain victory over that.
First, thanks for watching the movie and reporting back! I love the feedback, and I'm glad the movie spoke to you. Yea, it's powerful.
In terms of the churches in Revelation, that's a great question. Your choices are all applicable at some level. That said, I feel like we're like Laodicea -- lukewarm, dulled from our material prosperity and our pleasure seeking. I don't think we have a religious veneer. Maybe we did previously, but I feel like that's dropped. Now, on balance, we don't even care about Christianity. While there is paganism, and it's increasing, I don't feel like that's us quite yet. While we certainly are trusting in our own power, nationally, I'm not sure what we're trusting in as far as the church goes. I think Laodicea is probably the most accurate, and it also squares with the "Satanic lullaby" that is described in the film. I feel like we were once an active Christian country and now things have gotten easy and we've just fallen away and gotten dull. But all that said, I'm open to other opinions. What do you and other people think?
Thanks for your answer David. I agree. It makes me wonder if American Christians would do as well under persecution as Iran, China, and others. We have the material prosperity, although that seems to be falling away as of late. The pleasure seeking is definitely there though. Only time will tell.
Persecution would refine the church, as it always does. It has the effect of separating those who really believe it from those who just fell into it for whatever reason (cultural Christians). Most of the Western church will fall away during the end times, when things get tough. During that time, people will have to choose between their own lives and Christ. Most will choose their own lives. Many of those will rollover long before it gets to the issue of life. They will choose comfort over Christ. So, to answer your question about whether we would do as well under persecution as the others, the answer is no. The average western Christian is a weakly believing cultural Christian who has never been forced to rely wholly on God. The average Iranian Christian, in contrast, relies on God to stay alive on a daily basis. That said, even in western societies, there are some that are committed to the point of death. One of my goals in writing Simple Christianity is to challenge people’s thinking about these issues and help people move beyond a thin, weak cultural Christianity and toward a stronger, dependent relationship with Jesus. And I include myself in that, too. I’m writing to strengthen my own thoughts and beliefs.
So true and thank you for writing about these things. In Iran and other non-Christian friendly nations people who convert do not make the decision lightly. If they convert they could be killed or ostracized. We do not have that problem here in the US so many of our Christians are untested and do not take their faith seriously. We need more people like you who are willing to disciple others. We all have much to learn when it comes to faith. Just wondering, are you a pastor?
Very interesting. Did you actually hear an audible voice of God or just in your mind? I have heard testimony of both. I have heard that Jesus prefers the meek, so no worries on the simple part.
"How many unbelieving people have you talked to about Jesus this month? How many new disciples are you working with?"
I try, but just get derision and "this conversation is over!" responses. I think about this often. How far should we go in trying to get people to believe in God and Jesus? We certainly can't run after them, tackle them and make them believe. I just let them go and pray for them on my own silently. I have no influence on my family members, let alone strangers.
Thank you for posting this. VOM reports that Iranians are experiencing dreams and visions of Jesus at a mind blowing rate. My pastor told us that he met a pastor who saves failing churches in America. He said that many are being turned into mosques. We really need a missionary movement right here in the US. Thank you for posting this movie, I can't wait to watch it.
Fascinating article and video, thank you. I really appreciate your posts. It's so easy today to lose track of Christ's message to love all others - your articles are always a wonderful reminder. God bless you.
Excellent movie! We watched it a couple of years ago and it is heart changing. We are trying to find a church that is willing to have a heart like this in Oregon. The message of the movie is challenging and yet inspiring at the same time.
I watched it this weekend! A beautiful movie that more American Christians need to see. People are not their governments, look at ours. I have a question for you David. If the American church was one of the 7 churches of Revelation, which one would it be? I had it down to 4 of them but couldn't decide which one fit.
Laodicea: the lukewarm church from materialism and pleasure seeking.
Sardis: seeming alive but really dead with an attractive religious veneer.
Thyatira: infiltrated with paganism.
Pergamon: the church that trusted their own power.
I wish I could say we were Philadelphia or even a Smyrna, but sadly we are not at this point in time. Iranian Christians and others around the world that are under persecution have so much to teach us about really following Christ, but unfortunately many here only see them as our enemy. To me, one of the things this movie was putting out was that there must be a true Christian world church that is united against evil. The NWO has plans for a false one world religion that only seeks to destroy true faith, and bring us all into slavery under Satan. This true Christian church is our only hope to attain victory over that.
First, thanks for watching the movie and reporting back! I love the feedback, and I'm glad the movie spoke to you. Yea, it's powerful.
In terms of the churches in Revelation, that's a great question. Your choices are all applicable at some level. That said, I feel like we're like Laodicea -- lukewarm, dulled from our material prosperity and our pleasure seeking. I don't think we have a religious veneer. Maybe we did previously, but I feel like that's dropped. Now, on balance, we don't even care about Christianity. While there is paganism, and it's increasing, I don't feel like that's us quite yet. While we certainly are trusting in our own power, nationally, I'm not sure what we're trusting in as far as the church goes. I think Laodicea is probably the most accurate, and it also squares with the "Satanic lullaby" that is described in the film. I feel like we were once an active Christian country and now things have gotten easy and we've just fallen away and gotten dull. But all that said, I'm open to other opinions. What do you and other people think?
Thanks for your answer David. I agree. It makes me wonder if American Christians would do as well under persecution as Iran, China, and others. We have the material prosperity, although that seems to be falling away as of late. The pleasure seeking is definitely there though. Only time will tell.
Persecution would refine the church, as it always does. It has the effect of separating those who really believe it from those who just fell into it for whatever reason (cultural Christians). Most of the Western church will fall away during the end times, when things get tough. During that time, people will have to choose between their own lives and Christ. Most will choose their own lives. Many of those will rollover long before it gets to the issue of life. They will choose comfort over Christ. So, to answer your question about whether we would do as well under persecution as the others, the answer is no. The average western Christian is a weakly believing cultural Christian who has never been forced to rely wholly on God. The average Iranian Christian, in contrast, relies on God to stay alive on a daily basis. That said, even in western societies, there are some that are committed to the point of death. One of my goals in writing Simple Christianity is to challenge people’s thinking about these issues and help people move beyond a thin, weak cultural Christianity and toward a stronger, dependent relationship with Jesus. And I include myself in that, too. I’m writing to strengthen my own thoughts and beliefs.
So true and thank you for writing about these things. In Iran and other non-Christian friendly nations people who convert do not make the decision lightly. If they convert they could be killed or ostracized. We do not have that problem here in the US so many of our Christians are untested and do not take their faith seriously. We need more people like you who are willing to disciple others. We all have much to learn when it comes to faith. Just wondering, are you a pastor?
Nope, not a pastor. I'm just a guy with a keyboard. :-) See here for more background: https://simplechristianity.substack.com/p/simple-christianity
Very interesting. Did you actually hear an audible voice of God or just in your mind? I have heard testimony of both. I have heard that Jesus prefers the meek, so no worries on the simple part.
"How many unbelieving people have you talked to about Jesus this month? How many new disciples are you working with?"
I try, but just get derision and "this conversation is over!" responses. I think about this often. How far should we go in trying to get people to believe in God and Jesus? We certainly can't run after them, tackle them and make them believe. I just let them go and pray for them on my own silently. I have no influence on my family members, let alone strangers.
It’s definitely a hard question. I have some thoughts based on the method in Sheep Among Wolves, v2, that I’ll share in some future posts.
Thank you for posting this. VOM reports that Iranians are experiencing dreams and visions of Jesus at a mind blowing rate. My pastor told us that he met a pastor who saves failing churches in America. He said that many are being turned into mosques. We really need a missionary movement right here in the US. Thank you for posting this movie, I can't wait to watch it.
Yep, lots of dreams where Jesus visits the person and basically says, “I’m the savior.” Powerful stuff. Would love to know your reaction to the film.
Very powerful. I hope to watch it this weekend.
Fascinating article and video, thank you. I really appreciate your posts. It's so easy today to lose track of Christ's message to love all others - your articles are always a wonderful reminder. God bless you.
Thank you for the kind words. Your comments always inspire me.
Excellent movie! We watched it a couple of years ago and it is heart changing. We are trying to find a church that is willing to have a heart like this in Oregon. The message of the movie is challenging and yet inspiring at the same time.
There is also an excellent series of videos that have transformed our understanding of love. https://www.lovedefinedministry.org/lovedefined-course. Weyman and Susan are well worth watching.